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User:Димитрий Улянов Иванов, ScienceDirect topics is a random collection of excerpts that an algorithm thinks may be relevant to the subject. Its content changes all the time so claims based on it are nor verifiable, the quotes on it are out of context which limits their utility, and the authors that wrote the excerpts are not credited when only Topics is cited. That's why its use is deprecated on Wikipedia according to WP:RSP. I'll be removing the citation again but if you can find the paper you were talking about in your edit, I don't have any problem with you adding it in place of the Topics citation. HansVonStuttgart (talk) 14:37, 1 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No problem, sorry for the misplaced citation. My contention was just that it is identified by the International Consensus Statement on ADHD as a reputable source. I will reference that instead. Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 21:01, 1 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Evaluating the evidence for the efficacy of exercise
Although the article cites a series of studies suggesting exercise is efficacious for reducing the symptoms of ADHD, the International Consensus Statement on ADHD concluded that exercise has no statistically significant effects due to the results of two comprehensive meta-analyses and systematic reviews.1
Since that is the global scientific consensus, it seems to me that it may need to take priority as a replacement of the statements entirely, as I've seen elsewhere. But would the best course of action be to reference both lines of evidence? Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 18:53, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would include both POVs as excercise as a method of treatment for ADHD has tons of conflicting evidence and I don't think there is sufficiant evidence to completely disprove it's effectiveness, however results have been conflicted about how effective it is. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 17:09, 26 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is a very simple edit, but the hyperlink to Autism in the "differential diagnosis" section in the sidebar is outdated, being listed as "autism spectrum disorder." If this could be changed ASAP, that would be wonderful. Thank you. Smartestpuppy (talk) 22:51, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but Autism Spectrum Disorder is not an outdated name; for it is currently established by standardised diagnostic criteria (i.e., DSM-5, ICD-11) and the developers of evidence-based international guidelines (e.g. WHO, NICE). Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 17:31, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with @Omphalographer that the current image is unnecessary, considering it hardly represents the disorder. While academic performance is a common domain of impairment for those with ADHD, the implication that it is primarily a school-based issue trivialises the seriousness of ADHD and the main domains in life it impacts, especially when the image fails to capture symptomatic expressions.
It may be prudent to find a replacement image but some candidates could be showcasing the underlying neurology of ADHD or the relationship of the executive functions to its behavioural and cognitive expressions (see Barkley et al. for figures). That would convey ADHD much more comprehensively. Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 11:00, 23 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You can barely read anything with the image you added. The text should at least be readable as a thumbnail. There's also a similar existing image in the article. – The Grid (talk) 16:51, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The text is readable viewing from both my laptop and mobile. Plenty of infobox images use images with text around this size (e.g. Bulgarian or russian alphabet) and I'm not aware of a guideline prohibiting this, especially when its evidently readable. Even then, the image can always be made to appear larger. And there is no comparable image already in the article; this is the only image in the article which displays both the neuroanatomy and neuropsychology of ADHD and their relationship with each other, with description.
ADHD is, at it's core, a disorder of executive functioning and self-regulation. Depicting that in the infobox in a summatory way is important, rather than an arbitrary picture of a school environment, which does not represent ADHD or its symptoms, and trivialises the disorder for the reasons we discussed. Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 17:10, 24 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ADHD is, at it's core, a disorder of executive functioning and self-regulation. Depicting that in the infobox in a summatory way is important, rather than an arbitrary picture of a school environment, which does not represent ADHD or its symptoms
I don't agree. The school environment is shown because in the DSM IV explains Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder is a disorder classified throughout infancy, childhood, and adolescence (this was changed in DSM-5 to include adults), the list of items have focus on social, school, or work functioning. [1] An infobox is for summarizing the content that is in the prose. We also have the lede that is for summarizing the article in a few paragraphs.
It seems trying to summarize the item twice is overkill for the prose and infobox. That's where I even question having an image at the start but the school environment picture made some sense towards that. Showing a brain seems to be like any other disorder. (MOS:LEADIMAGE provides some guidance.) – The Grid (talk) 13:08, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for your diplomatic comments and the opportunity to discuss this further. I address each of these below:
R.e. ADHD symptoms and impairments
I understand you referenced the DSM-5 (2013) but relying on that is problematic for several reasons, which I will discuss below. First, consider the International Classification of Diseases v-11 (ICD-11) (World Health Organization) (2022) which makes it clear that "In order for a diagnosis to be made, manifestations of inattention and/or hyperactivity-impulsivity must be evident across multiple situations or settings (e.g., home, school, work, with friends or relatives), but are likely to vary according to the structure and demands of the setting.",1 as does the European Consensus Statement on ADHD.2
They do not emphasise the school setting or any for that matter, but do emphasise the presence of impairment in multiple settings which can vary. It references examples which include home, work, friends, and relatives, and thus more. Even then, both the DSM and ICD are used for differential diagnosis which means certain symptoms and impairments central to the disorder (like emotional dysregulation and impairments in EF in daily life) have been excluded to reduce overlap with other conditions or diagnostic complications, yet remain core to the disorder.2
Also note that the DSM does not lead the research, but is often a decade or two behind where the research and scientific consensus is at that time. And the decisions made by the APA are political, not just scientifically based, so it's hard to know where this will go in the subsequent version.
More importantly is that ADHD symptoms are impairing in a substantial variety of settings, not merely school or academic functioning. There is a global scientific consensus that there is so many things it impairs, such as driving, taking care of oneself, cohabiting with others, executive functioning in daily life, health and routine, substance use, teenage pregnancy, financial management, comorbidity, criminality, overall quality of life, self-esteem, hobbies, other life commitments, etc. etc. as a direct result of its underlying self-regulatory and executive deficits. You can read extensive references about these in the International [Global] Consensus Statement on ADHD3, the European Consensus Statement on ADHD, and other peer-reviewed research (e.g.4, 5). So the previous image is indeed trivialising and probably stigmatising.
R.e. Current image
I disagree that the image is akin to any other disorder, considering it shows the relationship of ADHD's neuropsychology and neuroanatomy.
I understand it may not be optimal, and certainly there may be better alternatives out there or perhaps no image at all. However, the same issue you described is applicable to the previous image caption in that it describes an ADHD symptom mentioned in the lede (inattention) and a lead paragraph (hyperfocus). The current image caption does mention executive dysfunction as well that is mentioned in the lede, but is focused much more on the neuroanatomy (implicated brain regions) which is not mentioned in the lede or any below paragraphs.
Interpretation
In my view, the current image is good, but no image is also good (as in the ASD article) or an alternative one that is better fitting. There may be problems with it. I do however disagree with the use of the previous image. If a consensus cannot be reached, the infobox image can be excluded entirely. Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 14:41, 25 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would go for no image altogether if that's the case. Also, are you using LLM (AI) for responses? The responses you have been providing isn't normal for someone whose primary language is other than English. It's more than simple lexicon. If you're using some type of automation tool, it should be disclosed. The type of automation is very similar to using user scripts where the edits are disclosed and the pattern of edits are known. An essay about the use of them on Wikipedia. – The Grid (talk) 14:44, 26 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am fine with that so long as there is a consensus; currently there isn’t.
Also, no, I am not. I have been learning English for a long time. It also comes from knowing my material as well or better than others so there is no hesitation when writing due to uncertainty. Confused as to the basis for your assumption, especially with my word dumping. Димитрий Улянов Иванов (talk) 15:05, 26 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
level-5 vital article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
